Veloce or Avio – help required please?

[Zeus44]

Hi all – new member here, very happy to meet you all!

I've been sniffing around the Veloce and Avio for many months now and feel I am very, very close to taking the plunge. I was just after a bit of advice on which model to go for.

I will use the bike all year round and do approximately 10k per year. I've test ridden a 2 year old Veloce (and adored it) but wonder if the Avio may be more what I am after.

If I go for the Veloce I may have to buy second-hand (2007 ish) but could perhaps stretch to a brand spanking new Avio – bearing in mind the 3 year warranty and fueling problems on previous versions I've seen mention on here I'm leaning towards the Avio, but still not entirely sold.

I found the Termi's on the Veloce to be a fantastic noise but the brakes were a bit thin – does anyone know if the Avio standard exhaust sounds similar and whether the brakes are better or worse than the Veloce?

One final thing, I know you don't buy a bike like this for economy, but is there a huge mpg difference between the two bikes when ridden fairly normally?

Any help will be greatly appreciated!

[Emmohaswheelsagain]

Hi Zeus,

If you set on buying the 2007 veloce then do not worry about the fueling problems, you will have the balance of the warranty until 2010 and hopefully the backing of a good dealer to help you smooth out any issues you have. I can only speak from my own experience with my 2006 9.5 and the 1st class service from Stuart at NLM.
It is really though a matter of what you want, a raw edged rocket ship with attitude or a softer, smoother power delivery of the Avio. There's not much to choose on mpg here, both are quick and you will pay when you start to enjoy that Morini exhaust note.
I would go for the Avio but then you would expect that since the 9.5 shares the same engine spec along with the Sport & Gran Passo. You just enjoy the process of choosing and remember Morini's are a choice of riders.

Regards

Paul

[franky]

The brakes must have needed a service as they are top class on a veloce, esp if you can get a 2008 one with radial M/C, i'd go for a veloce over an avio every time.

[corsaro chris]

Zeus;

Welcome to the Forum!

You obviously enjoy looking at the bikes, and its all part of the purchasing experience As Paul says, you'll need to visit a good dealer, and 3X or NLM are the only ones likely to have a full range of bikes in for you to test... essential in your envious position.

You mention the Corsaro ~ Avio / Veloce comparison, but as Franky says the choice here is non-existant - it has to be the Veloce

Why? Because, if you want a softer option, the 9.5 - or better still the Sport - are going to deliver more. The Avio appears unfinished to many, and after buying it you might always wonder if you should have got the other.

Good hunting, and keep us posted

CC

[Zeus44]

Thanks for all the replies.

I went down and saw Mark at 3x on Saturday who was a top chap and took the time to take me through the range. I then test rode their Veloce. Even though I couldn't ride the Avio (as a magazine had borrowed it for a test) I now know the Veloce is the one for me! (Their bike has baffles removed – OMG that is a noise that whets the brain and moistens the underwear!)

As Franky said, the brakes are top class and as both he and Corsaro Chris said, there is no comparison. Emmo: I think I want that raw edged rocket ship!

The 9.5 is also drop dead gorgeous. A minor additional cosmetic point: Now I've seen the red of the Avio (as they had one in the showroom for sale) it is nowhere near as deep and Italian as the Veloce red.

Unfortunately the Euro exchange rate may have pushed a new Veloce out of my reach temporarily . . . watch this space!

[Emmohaswheelsagain]

Hi Zeus,

I guess the Veloce is the one. It now a matter of new or second hand. I must say I went down the route of the latter with the 3 year warranty and all. Have a look around there are nearly new Veloce about so you might not have to wait. I like red also, looks mean, capable of eating Fireblades and your licence too I suppose.
good luck.

Paul

[GaryR]

Hello Everyone,

I have been seriously considering a Morini for some time initially the 91/2 and then the Avio after it was introduced. But the last few months I've read quite a bit about the fueling problems and other niggly things that after a while, put me off them. So I've been looking at the Guzzi Breva and BMW 1200R though my heart is still with the Morini. I've noticed that the magazine reports are thin, say very little thats negative, and don't really get into the guts of these issues that you read about on the forums. The impression is that they are beautiful exciting machines, but trouble in some form or another. I've seen nothing on the net to suggest the fueling problem is solved.

I was especially interested in the bit about talking someone into the Veloce rather than the Avio. Is that because of the power? Do you think you'll be bored with the Avio after a while, or is there a difference in the handling? Also the suggestion that the 91/2 is preferable to the Avio for someone set on the detuned motor. Why?

I'm over 50, spent my youth on 60s and 70s Bonnevilles, so perhaps like Emmo, think that the detuned motor is more practical for me now. I want torque rather than raw power and doubt I'll be breaking any track records anywhere.

Would appreciate any comments and replies.
Thanks,
Gary

[morini_tom]

Gary,

Sorry for the long answer but i just wanted to get all my thoughts on the percieved reliability/quality issues down.

For me it is all a matter of personal choice and perception. I don't think it is possible to buy a bad motorcycle nowadays, but there is an ever increasing demand for more reliability, better performance, better quality etc etc and that makes it so much harder for the small manufacturers. The fact that Morini have a) survived b) continued to increase their product range and c) are starting to get very good reviews I think is testament to how good their new bikes are.

I think that the new bikes were probably launched too early, and that to some extent the first owners were 'development riders,' but I also think that is entirely acceptable, given the attitude Morini have to their customers (One which I have never seen even remotely matched by any other manufactrer). I had an early 2006 corsaro which did occasionally suffer starting problems, glitchy fuelling and the odd niggle, yet on every occasion the problem was sorted without quibble and as quickly as possible. I once got stranded on a Friday afternoon and called 3X, who emailed the factory asking for suggestions. Within an hour the factory had replied with a suggestion (which worked!) and I was on my way. Try doing that with Yamaha...

The factory released (free) updates to cure various problems (including new EMS) and bit by bit the bike improved. The dealers have been very proactive in ensuring all bikes had the needed updates so there shouldn't be any bikes out there with these issues (my 2006 bike was brought up to 2008 spec fully under warranty). So now I don't think it really matters if you have an early bike or a new one, they should all be updated and running sweetly. If not, make sure it's done (don't forget 3 years warranty)

I traded the corsaro in last summer for... another corsaro. The new corsaro has been 100% faultless from the outset, and I think the reason that as you say magazine reports don't go into the issues is that the issues are largely history. The fuelling is better than i think 99% of riders will ever appreciate- there is still some shunt in town but it's a highly tuned big twin for gawd sake, and it's nowhere near as lumpy as any Ducati I've ridden. My corsaro has averaged 37.5mpg over the last couple of thousand miles.

The bike can happily do both brain-out perfomance and well mannered. It's Jekyl and hyde. Dad even uses his Veloce for commuting through London...

So really I think it's down to your personal preference and how you treat a bike. The quality is good, and initial gremlins aside (all now sorted) I think the only thing which let my '06 down was the paintwork which looked like it had been sprayed with moisture in the line.

So having decided that you want a morini, now the hard question: which one! Really it falls into two categories which only you can decide. Styling wise it's pretty straightforward, choose the one which makes you drool most. Engine wise, you really need a test ride. Even the 'detuned' engines have 117hp so in the real world I think you'll have ample unless you ride everywhere flat out. Realistically I rarely get the most out of my corsaro engine and I think I'd be just as happy with it if it had half as much power. Then again, it is addictive. And it does allow you to be very lazy with the gears!

Go on... do it!

In my opinion a Morini is the most sensible silly bike you can buy.

[yaaan]

I suppose as the proud and happy owner of an Avio I should throw in my tuppence worth....pretty much what morini_tom said!

I came across the Avio whilst busily browsing the internet at work one day and was pretty taken with it from the start. I arranged a test ride with 3x, took it out, was hooked and bought it with no regrets.

A short while later I was back at 3x having the first service and they had the Veloce out on test and hearing that come back I wondered if I should have take the plunge and gone for that instead To be honest though, the Avio was big enough step up for me from Speed4. Would the extra 20bhp or so have made me a happier person? I doubt it. As an introduction to big twins the Avio is perfect and will keep me happy for many years. It has more performance than I will ever use but enough to get me into trouble if I want. Maybe one day I'll trade up to the Veloce (unless they bring out something even more interesting before then) but until then I'm more than happy with the Avio.

I've only had two minor problems with it, battery not charging correctly which was sorted very promptly by 3x and has been fine since, and a little corrosion on the clutch cover which will be sorted when I get back to the UK next month. Neither of these have been show stopper or has dented my enthusiasm for the brand and would have no hesitation in recommending one to anybody. Honestly though, you're not going to be disappointed with either of them. The Avio is nice and usable (although I haven't tried the Veloce yet to see if that is any less friendly) and will keep you grinning for a long time...plus it's something of a conversation piece too as practically no-one has ever seen one! There is a lot to be said for exclusivety

Happy test riding

[Zeus44]

Hi Gary,

As you'll see from the beginning of this thread, I was in the same boat as you and, after doing a ton of research became more and more concerned that the long list of problems encountered by Morinin 'early adopters' was still an issue. Morini Tom's post combined with actually talking to dealers and riders has entirely removed these worries for me.

I'm still looking for my perfect Veloce as the Euro increase has put a new one out of my price range (and outside my mental justification for buying one!)

The Avio is an awesome bike and that would have been my choice (and still might be) but don't forget the standard Corsaro 1200 which has the same 140bhp engine as the Veloce but without the expensive race toys.

As I've said before in this thread, I was very disappointed with the red they have used on the Avio – it is more orange than red and really doesn't look anything like the promotional pictures that I have drooled over on my Mac for so long. To me it looks 'cheap' and, having seen a used red seat, it doesn't look pretty with wear. When spending this lump of money, I want something that looks as expensive as it actually was!

Good luck with your search.[/i]

[GaryR]

First of all, thanks to all of you for replying. And I certainly don't mind a long reply. As you can tell I feel starved for information.

I'd appreciate your opinions on why people here are suggesting the Cosaro over the Avio. Is it only horsepower or is there a difference in handling?
Also the remark about the 91/2 delivering more than the Avio. Is that comfort or something like that?

Thanks,
Gary

[corsaro chris]

Gary;

Personal opinions differ, but for me the quality of finish on the Avio is where Morini are saving their money. That and the removal of the oil cooler, cheaper suspension and last years brake components (last not an issue as the standard Corsaro brakes are good enough for the road).

In contract the "full fat" Corsaro has a nicer paint job, and in the UK there are a number of clean examples around... As to fueling; I have an early one and there were some issues (not over fueling) but they have all been sorted and the bike now (over the past 12 months) has run very well. Like Tom I'm getting around 35/37 mpg - good enough for most, although I'd love to get 45+. But if I want to be a miser I've got a smaller Morini...

The 9.5 has different tyres and a softer riding position - actually very nice, although I found the front suspension a little vague.

If the Avio doesn't feel up to the mark, look at the Sport - similar price to the 9.5 but that little bit sharper without the compromises of the Corsaro family (i.e. - you can get a pillion on, plus some luggage, but still press on...)

In the end - its what you want that counts - the Avio has got some good press reviews here, so Morini must be happy

Good riding,

CC

[Emmohaswheelsagain]

Hi Gary,

Lots of advice for you, I hope you have benefited from all those words of wisdom. One further point as you were a triumph man, how many of your Bonnevilles leaked oil? I guess none however that didn't stop people looking for an oil leak when they walked past your bike. Like many brands Morini has always suffered from negative reports, just ocassionally a real biker comes along and puts the record straight. Don't be put off, experience the models yourself. I looked at the Breva, great bike but no real edge. Chris is right, try the Sport or do as I did and find an ex demo 9.5. Your Morini out there you just need to try them to see which one suits you.
All the best.

Paul

[GaryR]

Thanks very much for all your input. This is the sort of info I wanted. Will keep you posted what happens.

Gary

[Henrik]

This has been an interesting discussion so far, and I thought I would join in the fun being a Corsaro owner since last year.

For starters, I am surprised at the debate between the Avio and the Veloce. I know there was a mention of it, but why not the normal Corsaro?

Anyway, I ended up buying a Corsaro last year after a lot of thought and consideration. Having been riding for a long time, having had all sorts of bikes, I wanted to get a roadster, and preferably a twin. So, I set out on a quest to find the right bike for me, and ended up testing just about everything that is out there. Initially my mind was more or less set on a Brutale 910S, even though I tend to prefer twins. I loved the chassis of the Brutale, and having spent some time on a Brutale 750, I found the 910 a considerable improvement with more torque. Still, then I went on to try the following:

KTM Superduke,
Ducati Monster S4R
Aprilia Tuono
BMW K1200R
Benelli TNT 899
Triumph Speed Triple

Out of these, I was leaning towards the KTM or the Aprilia. However, the problem with the Aprilia here is that there are basically no dealers left, so they are very hard to find. A good friend of mine suggested I also have a go on the Corsaro, even though I was not convinced as I had heard it was not too reliable, and I didn’t really like the looks from the photos I had seen. Still, I had a go, and I was sold instantly!

The first thing was the position on the bike. I am fairly tall at 187cm, but the Corsaro was a perfect fit. I always felt a bit cramped on the Tuono and the Brutale, and it was only on the Superduke that I had also been comfortable (even the big BMW has too short space for the legs I find). It was simply amazingly comfortable. Then switching it on, the sound was brilliant with the QD pipes that were mounted. Taking off was so effortless, and dealing with the city traffic was no problem. I could not understand the fueling complaints I had heard about, as this was one of the smoothest rides I had ever tried. Then, getting out of the city, it was the incredible power and torque of the Corsaro that blew my mind, and finally the general handling convinced me that this was the best bike I had ever ridden.

The problem then was that I wanted an all black bike, as I did not really like the black and silver of the normal Corsaro. As luck would have it, the shop had a perfect second hand black normal Corsaro, and an all black gas tank. So, it was just a question of changing the tank, and I got what I think is the best of both worlds as the gold forks really improve things over the all black ones on the Veloce. As for exhausts, the bike came with a full QD set-up with the catalytic converter removed, which for me gives a better looking result than the Termignoni on the Veloce. Power is estimated at over 150hp with this setup, and there certainly is no shortage of it!

In summary, the Corsaro is an incredible bike, that can be docile when you want it to as you commute to work through town, or a mind-blowing beast on mountain roads or on the track.

This has been an interesting discussion so far, and I thought I would join in the fun being a Corsaro owner since last year.

For starters, I am surprised at the debate between the Avio and the Veloce. I know there was a mention of it, but why not the normal Corsaro?

Anyway, I ended up buying a Corsaro last year after a lot of thought and consideration. Having been riding for a long time, having had all sorts of bikes, I wanted to get a roadster, and preferably a twin. So, I set out on a quest to find the right bike for me, and ended up testing just about everything that is out there. Initially my mind was more or less set on a Brutale 910S, even though I tend to prefer twins. I loved the chassis of the Brutale, and having spent some time on a Brutale 750, I found the 910 a considerable improvement with more torque. Still, then I went on to try the following:

KTM Superduke,
Ducati Monster S4R
Aprilia Tuono
BMW K1200R
Benelli TNT 899
Triumph Speed Triple

Out of these, I was leaning towards the KTM or the Aprilia. However, the problem with the Aprilia here is that there are basically no dealers left, so they are very hard to find. A good friend of mine suggested I also have a go on the Corsaro, even though I was not convinced as I had heard it was not too reliable, and I didn’t really like the looks from the photos I had seen. Still, I had a go, and I was sold instantly!

The first thing was the position on the bike. I am fairly tall at 187cm, but the Corsaro was a perfect fit. I always felt a bit cramped on the Tuono and the Brutale, and it was only on the Superduke that I had also been comfortable (even the big BMW has too short space for the legs I find). It was simply amazingly comfortable. Then switching it on, the sound was brilliant with the QD pipes that were mounted. Taking off was so effortless, and dealing with the city traffic was no problem. I could not understand the fueling complaints I had heard about, as this was one of the smoothest rides I had ever tried. Then, getting out of the city, it was the incredible power and torque of the Corsaro that blew my mind, and finally the general handling convinced me that this was the best bike I had ever ridden.

The problem then was that I wanted an all black bike, as I did not really like the black and silver of the normal Corsaro. As luck would have it, the shop had a perfect second hand black normal Corsaro, and an all black gas tank. So, it was just a question of changing the tank, and I got what I think is the best of both worlds as the gold forks really improve things over the all black ones on the Veloce. As for exhausts, the bike came with a full QD set-up with the catalytic converter removed, which for me gives a better looking result than the Termignoni on the Veloce. Power is estimated at over 150hp with this setup, and there certainly is no shortage of it!

In summary, the Corsaro is an incredible bike, that can be docile when you want it to as you commute to work through town, or a mind-blowing beast on mountain roads or on the track.